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On 25/03/2021 11:51 Eric Oyen via chirp_users <chirp_users@intrepid.danplanet.com> wrote:
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</div>Hey Nigel?
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I am going to ask something here, and it might get you irritated, but please understand that it is important and also within the context of this group.
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Do you have any kind of visual impairment that negatively impacts your ability to use specific software on whatever platform you choose to use?
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No and neither do most who ask questions on here.
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I can tell you right now, if you don’t, then you don’t have any real understanding of the problems that me and others on this list (who do) have when it comes to software. Screen readers and braille displays are pretty much a must when you can’t see the screen.
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If you need and special considerations like screen readers and braille displays, it helps if you mention that when asking for assistance.
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Now, someone suggested the use of Libre office. That’s all fine and good if you are on a Linux OS. Not so useful on either the OS X or windows platforms when a screen reader/braille display is in use.. This means we are limited in what we can (or can’t) use on a given platform at a given time and set of circumstances. The same is true for CHIRP. I can only use it on Linux and no where else.
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Libre Office runs fine on Linux, Apple Mac and Windows. Just download the version that you require.
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Also, on the subject of CSV and TSV files, both of those are standardized formats that shouldn’t be presenting any issues. I use the 2010 version of excel and word here on the windows machine as nothing later is supported (it’s windows 7). So far, I have not encounter the issues you spoke of. If MS excel is introducing these types of errors, then they broke something and are violating standardized formats doing so.
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The CSV file format is standard but the contents certainly are not. A CSV spreadsheet exported from Chirp has many empty cells in eash row. Excel is known to insert unwanted characters into some of these cells which then stops the spreadsheet being imported back into Chirp. Libre Office and Open Office don't show this problem.
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Now, as for me, I am totally blind (literally). I have no light perception, so I expect all my tools to work in an expected fashion. If they don’t, then I am in serious trouble. This pretty much means that I have to be very conversant with them and how they work at the software/hardware level.
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So, when it comes to CHIRP, I really wish it were fully accessible using braille or screen reader on platforms other than just Linux. Until that happens, I have to keep up on the latest tools (such as more specialized radio programming software that is accessible on windows or OS X), office packages that need to communicate with one another regardless of platform etc. Unfortunately, being totally blind makes that rather more difficult under the best of circumstances. So, unless you have a real understanding of how those of us without sight have to function, then you really don’t have any understanding at all. Oh, and if you *THINK* that wearing a blindfold will help you understand, no it won’t. It’s because, at the end of the day, you will still be able to take it off and use your eyes. Those of us who don’t have that option have to spend longer doing some tasks, use alternative methods to get our info, or even use radio programming software with tools designed to work around the lack of eyesight issue. The chirp package is no exception to this. If I want to use windows to program my radios, I have to use RT systems on that oS platform. I don’t get a choice. On OS X, there are NO accessible packages or methodologies that will allow me to program a radio like my UV5R, or the PK-888, the Retevus H777s, or even my midland g40. Most of these can be handled by Chirp on linux and no where else for me. Now, lets see you try and maintain 3 os platforms, on separate machines, having to know keyboard commands for each screen reader, etc. I can do it because I am cursed with an Eidetic memory. When I say cursed, I mean it. If any changes get made, I have to account for those, etc. that means my head gets full and I have no way to dump those memories. On the plus side, once I pick up something, I never lose it again, ever.
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I suggest you take up the screenreader compatibility with Microsoft and Apple. You've admitted that screenreaders and Linux apps are usable so there's not a problem with Chirp.
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As for you aiming your frustration at me, My replies are generally helpful to the majority of people. I have no experience of blindness. Apologies if I'm, at times, not as considerate as could be.
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Anyway, enough of my ranting on software, accessibility, etc.
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DE n7zzt Eric
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On Mar 23, 2021, at 8:37 AM, Glenn K0LNY <<a class="" href="mailto:GlennErvin@cableone.net">GlennErvin@cableone.net</a>> wrote:
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<span class="" style="font-family: Arial; font-size: small;">Well from the perspective of a screenreader user, I find editing things much easier to make changes in a spreadsheet program outside of Chirp and import them after the changes were made, so I would call that, the better way.</span>
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<span class="" style="font-family: Arial; font-size: small;">Glenn</span>
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----- Original Message -----<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>
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<strong class="">From:</strong><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><a class="" href="mailto:nigel@ngunn.net">Nigel A. Gunn G8IFF/W8IFF</a>
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<strong class="">To:</strong><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><a class="" href="mailto:eric.oyen@icloud.com">Eric Oyen</a><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>;<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><a class="" href="mailto:chirp_users@intrepid.danplanet.com">Eric Oyen via chirp_users</a>
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<strong class="">Sent:</strong><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>Tuesday, March 23, 2021 7:45 AM
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<strong class="">Subject:</strong><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>Re: [chirp_users] I get an "unknown file format" when importing
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The best way is not to use CSV files at all.<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>
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On 23/03/2021 02:08 Eric Oyen via chirp_users <<a class="" href="mailto:chirp_users@intrepid.danplanet.com">chirp_users@intrepid.danplanet.com</a>> wrote:<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>
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</div>One good way I have found to edit CsV files is to use a spreadsheet program like Microsoft excel or one of the linux free variants. Simply import as a cSV, do your editing, then export back to a CSV file. Compare the original to the new edited version to make sure the same number of commas are in place on the right lines. BTW, I have already tried this on my windows box using excel and a program specifically designed for the Baofeng radio. So, it should work the same way with chirp as both that program and cHIRP should read or write CSV files in the same way.<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>
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DE n7zzt Eric<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>
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On Mar 20, 2021, at 11:39 AM, Jim Unroe <<a class="" href="mailto:rock.unroe@gmail.com">rock.unroe@gmail.com</a>> wrote:<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>
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<span class="" style="font-size: 12px; text-decoration: none; font-family: Monaco; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; text-transform: none; float: none; font-weight: normal; font-style: normal; letter-spacing: normal; text-indent: 0px; caret-color: #000000; font-variant-caps: normal; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; display: inline !important;">On Sat, Mar 20, 2021 at 1:25 PM Steve Vecchiarelli via chirp_users</span><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>
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<br class="">’m trying to import a csv file into CHIRP to upload back to my radio.<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>
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<br class="">Steps I’ve taken:<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>
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<br class="">Connected radio to CHIRP and downloaded the memories to CHIRP<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>
<br class="">Exported memories to a CSV file<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>
<br class="">Added the new frequencies to the CSV file<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>
<br class="">Saved CSV and tried to import back to CHIRP bur getting an unknown file format message<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>
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<br class="">What am I missing?<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>
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<br class="">Thanks for any help!<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>
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<br class="">Steve<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>
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<br class="" style="font-size: 12px; text-decoration: none; font-family: Monaco; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; text-transform: none; font-weight: normal; font-style: normal; letter-spacing: normal; text-indent: 0px; caret-color: #000000; font-variant-caps: normal; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;"><span class="" style="font-size: 12px; text-decoration: none; font-family: Monaco; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; text-transform: none; float: none; font-weight: normal; font-style: normal; letter-spacing: normal; text-indent: 0px; caret-color: #000000; font-variant-caps: normal; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; display: inline !important;">Did you compare the new CSV file to the original file CSV file using a</span><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>
<br class="" style="font-size: 12px; text-decoration: none; font-family: Monaco; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; text-transform: none; font-weight: normal; font-style: normal; letter-spacing: normal; text-indent: 0px; caret-color: #000000; font-variant-caps: normal; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;"><span class="" style="font-size: 12px; text-decoration: none; font-family: Monaco; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; text-transform: none; float: none; font-weight: normal; font-style: normal; letter-spacing: normal; text-indent: 0px; caret-color: #000000; font-variant-caps: normal; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; display: inline !important;">text editor?</span><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>
<br class="" style="font-size: 12px; text-decoration: none; font-family: Monaco; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; text-transform: none; font-weight: normal; font-style: normal; letter-spacing: normal; text-indent: 0px; caret-color: #000000; font-variant-caps: normal; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;"><span class="" style="font-size: 12px; text-decoration: none; font-family: Monaco; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; text-transform: none; float: none; font-weight: normal; font-style: normal; letter-spacing: normal; text-indent: 0px; caret-color: #000000; font-variant-caps: normal; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; display: inline !important;">Attach both the before and after CSV files to this conversation so</span><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>
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<br class="" style="font-size: 12px; text-decoration: none; font-family: Monaco; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; text-transform: none; font-weight: normal; font-style: normal; letter-spacing: normal; text-indent: 0px; caret-color: #000000; font-variant-caps: normal; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;"><span class="" style="font-size: 12px; text-decoration: none; font-family: Monaco; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; text-transform: none; float: none; font-weight: normal; font-style: normal; letter-spacing: normal; text-indent: 0px; caret-color: #000000; font-variant-caps: normal; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; display: inline !important;">This message was sent to Eric Oyen at<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span></span><a class="" style="font-size: 12px; font-family: Monaco; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; text-transform: none; font-weight: normal; font-style: normal; letter-spacing: normal; text-indent: 0px; font-variant-caps: normal; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" href="mailto:eric.oyen@icloud.com">eric.oyen@icloud.com</a><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>
<br class="" style="font-size: 12px; text-decoration: none; font-family: Monaco; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; text-transform: none; font-weight: normal; font-style: normal; letter-spacing: normal; text-indent: 0px; caret-color: #000000; font-variant-caps: normal; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;"><span class="" style="font-size: 12px; text-decoration: none; font-family: Monaco; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; text-transform: none; float: none; font-weight: normal; font-style: normal; letter-spacing: normal; text-indent: 0px; caret-color: #000000; font-variant-caps: normal; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; display: inline !important;">To unsubscribe, send an email to<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span></span><a class="" style="font-size: 12px; font-family: Monaco; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; text-transform: none; font-weight: normal; font-style: normal; letter-spacing: normal; text-indent: 0px; font-variant-caps: normal; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" href="mailto:chirp_users-unsubscribe@intrepid.danplanet.com">chirp_users-unsubscribe@intrepid.danplanet.com</a>
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</div>_______________________________________________ chirp_users mailing list <a class="" href="mailto:chirp_users@intrepid.danplanet.com">chirp_users@intrepid.danplanet.com</a> <a class="" href="http://intrepid.danplanet.com/mailman/listinfo/chirp_users">http://intrepid.danplanet.com/mailman/listinfo/chirp_users</a> This message was sent to Nigel Gunn, W8IFF at <a class="" href="mailto:nigel@ngunn.net">nigel@ngunn.net</a> To unsubscribe, send an email to <a class="" href="mailto:chirp_users-unsubscribe@intrepid.danplanet.com">chirp_users-unsubscribe@intrepid.danplanet.com</a><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>
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Nigel A. Gunn, ///shoulders.outwards.resolutions tel +1-937-971-0366
<br class="">Amateur Radio G8IFF W8IFF and GMRS WRBV701, <a class="" href="mailto:nigel@ngunn.net">e-mail nigel@ngunn.net</a> www <a class="" href="http://www.ngunn.net">http://www.ngunn.net</a><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>
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</div><span class="" style="caret-color: #000000; font-family: AppleSymbols; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; background-color: #ffffff; text-decoration: none; float: none; display: inline !important;">_______________________________________________</span>
<br class="" style="caret-color: #000000; font-family: AppleSymbols; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; background-color: #ffffff; text-decoration: none;"><span class="" style="caret-color: #000000; font-family: AppleSymbols; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; background-color: #ffffff; text-decoration: none; float: none; display: inline !important;">chirp_users mailing list</span>
<br class="" style="caret-color: #000000; font-family: AppleSymbols; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; background-color: #ffffff; text-decoration: none;"><a class="" style="font-family: AppleSymbols; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; background-color: #ffffff;" href="mailto:chirp_users@intrepid.danplanet.com">chirp_users@intrepid.danplanet.com</a>
<br class="" style="caret-color: #000000; font-family: AppleSymbols; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; background-color: #ffffff; text-decoration: none;"><a class="" style="font-family: AppleSymbols; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; background-color: #ffffff;" href="http://intrepid.danplanet.com/mailman/listinfo/chirp_users">http://intrepid.danplanet.com/mailman/listinfo/chirp_users</a>
<br class="" style="caret-color: #000000; font-family: AppleSymbols; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; background-color: #ffffff; text-decoration: none;"><span class="" style="caret-color: #000000; font-family: AppleSymbols; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; background-color: #ffffff; text-decoration: none; float: none; display: inline !important;">This message was sent to Glenn at<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span></span><a class="" style="font-family: AppleSymbols; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; background-color: #ffffff;" href="mailto:glennervin@cableone.net">glennervin@cableone.net</a>
<br class="" style="caret-color: #000000; font-family: AppleSymbols; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; background-color: #ffffff; text-decoration: none;"><span class="" style="caret-color: #000000; font-family: AppleSymbols; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; background-color: #ffffff; text-decoration: none; float: none; display: inline !important;">To unsubscribe, send an email to<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span></span><a class="" style="font-family: AppleSymbols; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; background-color: #ffffff;" href="mailto:chirp_users-unsubscribe@intrepid.danplanet.com">chirp_users-unsubscribe@intrepid.danplanet.com</a><span class="" style="caret-color: #000000; font-family: AppleSymbols; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; background-color: #ffffff; text-decoration: none; float: none; display: inline !important;">_______________________________________________</span>
<br class="" style="caret-color: #000000; font-family: AppleSymbols; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; background-color: #ffffff; text-decoration: none;"><span class="" style="caret-color: #000000; font-family: AppleSymbols; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; background-color: #ffffff; text-decoration: none; float: none; display: inline !important;">chirp_users mailing list</span>
<br class="" style="caret-color: #000000; font-family: AppleSymbols; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; background-color: #ffffff; text-decoration: none;"><a class="" style="font-family: AppleSymbols; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; background-color: #ffffff;" href="mailto:chirp_users@intrepid.danplanet.com">chirp_users@intrepid.danplanet.com</a>
<br class="" style="caret-color: #000000; font-family: AppleSymbols; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; background-color: #ffffff; text-decoration: none;"><a class="" style="font-family: AppleSymbols; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; background-color: #ffffff;" href="http://intrepid.danplanet.com/mailman/listinfo/chirp_users">http://intrepid.danplanet.com/mailman/listinfo/chirp_users</a>
<br class="" style="caret-color: #000000; font-family: AppleSymbols; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; background-color: #ffffff; text-decoration: none;"><span class="" style="caret-color: #000000; font-family: AppleSymbols; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; background-color: #ffffff; text-decoration: none; float: none; display: inline !important;">This message was sent to Eric Oyen at<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span></span><a class="" style="font-family: AppleSymbols; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; background-color: #ffffff;" href="mailto:eric.oyen@icloud.com">eric.oyen@icloud.com</a>
<br class="" style="caret-color: #000000; font-family: AppleSymbols; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; background-color: #ffffff; text-decoration: none;"><span class="" style="caret-color: #000000; font-family: AppleSymbols; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; background-color: #ffffff; text-decoration: none; float: none; display: inline !important;">To unsubscribe, send an email to<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span></span><a class="" style="font-family: AppleSymbols; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; background-color: #ffffff;" href="mailto:chirp_users-unsubscribe@intrepid.danplanet.com">chirp_users-unsubscribe@intrepid.danplanet.com</a>
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</div>_______________________________________________ chirp_users mailing list chirp_users@intrepid.danplanet.com http://intrepid.danplanet.com/mailman/listinfo/chirp_users This message was sent to Nigel Gunn, W8IFF at nigel@ngunn.net To unsubscribe, send an email to chirp_users-unsubscribe@intrepid.danplanet.com
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<p>Nigel A. Gunn, ///shoulders.outwards.resolutions tel +1-937-971-0366<br>Amateur Radio G8IFF W8IFF and GMRS WRBV701, e-mail nigel@ngunn.net www http://www.ngunn.net <br><br></p>
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