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<p>Gentlemen,<br>
</p>
<p>Would you please take your OT "holy war/debate" about antivirus
software someplace other than the [chirp_users] list....<br>
</p>
<p>Your current discussion thread has NOTHING to do with CHIRP.<br>
</p>
<div class="moz-signature">Thank You,<br>
<br>
--<br>
Michael Birch KD9BDL<br>
Grid: EN53la<br>
<br>
<br>
</div>
<div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 1/29/2018 8:53 AM, Kenneth L.
Bechtel, II wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote type="cite"
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<p class="MsoNormal">As someone who has been researching and
fighting Viruses/ Malware for 30 years, this is the most
IGNORANT, DANGEROUS advice that I’ve come across lately.
This is in no way shape or form how AV products work. Yes, I
preach the most effective tools are basic security practices,
but those practices include the proper defensive tools. HOW
THE HECK can you know you’re not infected if you haven’t even
checked your system. That’s like saying I’m healthy because a
doctor hasn’t told me I have high blood pressure, and since I
haven’t been told I haven’t seen a doctor in 10 years. It’s
advice such as this (along with I don’t run av because I run a
Mac/Linux and there is nothing targeting them). Please Leave
the defensive advice to the professionals who KNOW what they
are talking about, thank you<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Courier
New";color:black">Kenneth L. Bechtel, II<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Courier
New";color:black">Team Anti-Virus<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Courier
New";color:black">Phone: 717-473-0839
|Member AVAR<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Courier
New";color:black">email - <a
href="mailto:kbechtel@teamanti-virus.org"
moz-do-not-send="true">kbechtel@teamanti-virus.org</a>
|Founding Member AVIEN<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Courier
New";color:black">PGP Footprint: 969E 2A27 3042 EE52
AEFB 6FF0 2711 9467 D38C 5C0F<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><b>From:</b>
<a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:chirp_users-bounces@intrepid.danplanet.com">chirp_users-bounces@intrepid.danplanet.com</a>
[<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="mailto:chirp_users-bounces@intrepid.danplanet.com">mailto:chirp_users-bounces@intrepid.danplanet.com</a>] <b>On
Behalf Of </b>Dennis Smith<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Monday, January 29, 2018 9:37 AM<br>
<b>To:</b> Dave B <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:g8kbv@uku.co.uk"><g8kbv@uku.co.uk></a>; Discussion of CHIRP
<a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:chirp_users@intrepid.danplanet.com"><chirp_users@intrepid.danplanet.com></a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [chirp_users] [OT] Re: Problems with
Norton etc.<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">Dump 3rd party AV suites and use the OS
provided AV tools. In order for antivirus software to work,
it needs to install hooks into the OS, introducing
weaknesses into the OS that were not there before. For an AV
to work they need to do all the things a virus does such as
man in the middle attacks EG reading your communications,
even secured communications. The OS developers know where
the right places to install it's own AV without weakening
the OS.<o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">It's hard to know where a virus ends
and the AV starts because they both do the same thing to
get installed starting with the similar social
and psychological tricks to get you to install them. And
once installed they both use these same tricks (but in
different ways) to make you keep them installed, or to
prevent uninstallation. A bit like different political
parties! <o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">As previously mentions, the best AV is
UNcommon sense! Think before you click, ask the following
questions : <o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">Who gains from this? Is there ulterior
motive such as gaining personal information?<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">*Did I ask for this? Unsolicited files
or offers are not free, nothing is free except risk.<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">*Do I want this? -- Does the file come
with an anything extra you didn't want<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">*Why are they asking me for this? -- EG
do they need my credit card number? All I need in some
cases is a name, half a telephone number or postcode/town
name and I can with reasonable certainty find someone and
dig really deep in to their personal life (I had to do
this for a job I had, I'm no expert but I always got my
target, a professional will always get you).<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">*Is this really the file I wanted? --
Do you know how to check the file for tampering by
checking the MD5 checksum?<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">And more importantly a good, tested
backup system known to be reliable and accessible is the
minimum safety you should have. I mirror my drive and have
copies made stored in my safe, and at a remote location.
The remote variant is in a uniquely sealed bag, but that's
just me. For many this is overkill. However, I can be up
and running from a dead PC in 20 minutes from exactly
where I left off.<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">I have not had a successful virus or
malware attack in 10 years since adopting this method.
SSD's instead of spinning rust drives are vastly faster,
and for the most part just as reliable, but with the back
ups it makes them even better. Also it's fair to say this
method works equally as well for Windows and Linux, and
probably Macs but since adding things like extra drives is
almost impossible, I have my doubts!<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"></RANT><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">Dennis Smith<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">M1DLG<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">On 29 January 2018 at 08:53, Dave B via
chirp_users <<a
href="mailto:chirp_users@intrepid.danplanet.com"
target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">chirp_users@intrepid.danplanet.com</a>>
wrote:<o:p></o:p></p>
<blockquote style="border:none;border-left:solid #CCCCCC
1.0pt;padding:0in 0in 0in
6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-right:0in">
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt">Quite
honestly, I'm amazed anyone still thinks running
Norton AV is an acceptable solution to a perceived
problem.<br>
<br>
It itself is riddled with inconsistencies and other
funnies, plus has a hair trigger for false positives.
"Not seen by many users" is NOT a good metric to judge
if something is bad or not.<br>
<br>
Windows own Windows Defender, in conjunction with
whatever "Security Essentials" is now called is more
than adequate for 90+% of users, and the price is
right.<br>
<br>
Coupled with the use of "uBlock Origin" in your web
browsers, to block the obnoxious nasties in on-line
add's, and you'll have a slick fast and more than safe
enough system. (Heck, that is even in the MS app
store now, as well as Chrome's webstore.)<br>
<br>
The single best AV tool, is common sense... Never,
and I mean NEVER <b>NEVER</b> Click on a popup you
didn't expect*, or go to a site or download something
<b>YOU DID NOT YOURSELF ASK OR GO LOOKING FOR</b>!<br>
<br>
And Never EVER respond to anything in unsolicited
(spam) email's, however attractive the proposition may
look.<br>
<br>
(* Not even any 'X' close button, that only confirms
that they've found a human, and may not even remove
the popup. Back out of that website/restart the
browser and find another with what you want.)<br>
<br>
Norton AV used to be good, it's now just more
bloat-ware, with questionable practices, and not in
truth a particularly good user experience.<br>
<br>
As above, the best AV tool, is the wet stuff between
your ears. As in all life, if something appears to
be too good to be true, it probably is bad for you,
your PC, and/or your bank account!<br>
<br>
73.<br>
<br>
Dave G0WBX.<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><br>
<br>
<br>
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</blockquote>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
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<pre wrap="">_______________________________________________
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