[chirp_users] chirp_users Digest, Vol 58, Issue 30

Hugh Wardlaw hwardlaw at bellsouth.net
Fri Oct 18 07:09:00 PDT 2013


Re: Yaesu programming

My experience with the FT-897D is that the engineering is poor. I never used chirp with the rig. It would simply die after a few months, sent it to them to repair and it kept going dead a few months after each repair. I use it now for a book-end. The lesson I learned is to not purchase any Yaesu gear. The techs fix symptoms - not the cause

Chirp works well. The trick is getting a good cable and the correct drivers for the cable. The other point is to read the rig's memory to ascertain that everything shows signs of working properly before attempting to write to the rig.


Sent via the Samsung GALAXY S®4, an AT&T 4G LTE smartphone

-------- Original message --------
From: chirp_users-request at intrepid.danplanet.com 
Date: 10/17/2013  6:25 PM  (GMT-06:00) 
To: chirp_users at intrepid.danplanet.com 
Subject: chirp_users Digest, Vol 58, Issue 30 
 
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Today's Topics:

   1. Re: Tim at Yaesu Tech Support warns against Chirp,	recommends
      RT Systems products (Charles Stillman)
   2. Re: Tim at Yaesu Tech Support warns against Chirp,	recommends
      RT Systems products (Charles Stillman)
   3. Re: Tim at Yaesu Tech Support warns against Chirp, recommends
      RT Systems products (Allan R. Batteiger)
   4. Re: Tim at Yaesu Tech Support warns against Chirp,	recommends
      RT Systems products (Milton Hywatt)
   5. Re: Tim at Yaesu Tech Support warns against Chirp, recommends
      RT Systems products (Dan Smith)
   6. Maxtrac, Radius, GM300 (Alex KG4TRV)
   7. Re: Tim at Yaesu Tech Support warns against Chirp,	recommends
      RT Systems products (Charles Stillman)


----------------------------------------------------------------------

Message: 1
Date: Thu, 17 Oct 2013 15:18:30 -0700
From: Charles Stillman <datademon at aol.com>
Subject: Re: [chirp_users] Tim at Yaesu Tech Support warns against
Chirp,	recommends RT Systems products
To: Discussion of CHIRP <chirp_users at intrepid.danplanet.com>
Message-ID: <9E61F840-C5A6-4A1B-84E8-C6739B1D3868 at aol.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii

I figured it would be all over the web if there were serious problems. I have no reason to doubt Tim's sincerity. Perhaps, someone involved with development could approach him to get more information about the supposed problems. I know if I had a problem, I'd be on this forum in a heartbeat.

I'll be demoing Chirp at our next HAM meeting here in Seattle so need to do my due diligence about what I'm recommending!

Charlie Stillman
KC1S

------------------------------

Message: 2
Date: Thu, 17 Oct 2013 15:23:33 -0700
From: Charles Stillman <datademon at aol.com>
Subject: Re: [chirp_users] Tim at Yaesu Tech Support warns against
Chirp,	recommends RT Systems products
To: Discussion of CHIRP <chirp_users at intrepid.danplanet.com>
Message-ID: <A88043C6-29B1-4FB1-B499-923C2CEB17C3 at aol.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii

I'm just speculating here as to what (if any) problems people might have reported to Yaesu. It certainly is possible to do damage with an inappropriate cable for example. Some people are quite willing to try the "blue smoke test" prior to reading the manual!

Charlie KC1S


On Oct 17, 2013, at 3:09 PM, Tom Hayward <esarfl at gmail.com> wrote:

> On Thu, Oct 17, 2013 at 3:05 PM, Tom Hayward <esarfl at gmail.com> wrote:
>> On Thu, Oct 17, 2013 at 3:02 PM, Charles Stillman <datademon at aol.com> wrote:
>>> Tim at Yaesu tech support says that Chirp "burns out" EEPROMS on Yaesu radios. He says that results in the radios locking up. It was not clear whether he was saying that the EEPROM was destroyed or just programmed into a state that the radio would no longer work. I'm guessing that this might have been a problem during Chirp development and is no longer the case. I see that there are several steps involved in programming the Yaesu radios with Chirp. Does failure to follow the steps precisely create a risk to the usability of the radio? Sorry if this has been discussed before.
>> 
>> No radios have EVER been permanently damaged during Chirp development.
>> I bet he has absolutely zero evidence to support his claims.
> 
> By the way, if you use a program like portmon to monitor the data
> Chirp sends to the radio, you'll find it sends exactly the same thing
> as RT Systems software or a clone from an identical model radio.
> 
> Tom KD7LXL
> _______________________________________________
> chirp_users mailing list
> chirp_users at intrepid.danplanet.com
> http://intrepid.danplanet.com/mailman/listinfo/chirp_users



------------------------------

Message: 3
Date: Thu, 17 Oct 2013 17:24:32 -0500
From: "Allan R. Batteiger" <arb at rtsi.com>
Subject: Re: [chirp_users] Tim at Yaesu Tech Support warns against
Chirp, recommends RT Systems products
To: Discussion of CHIRP <chirp_users at intrepid.danplanet.com>
Message-ID: <526063A0.5070609 at rtsi.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"

This is news to me I have been programming Yaesu Radios for several 
years using Chirp and never had a problem with any of the Radios.  I 
have programmed a number of different types of Yaesu, ICOM, Kenwood, etc 
and the only time I have had a problem is if I did not read the radio first.

Allan R. Batteiger


On 10/17/2013 5:18 PM, Charles Stillman wrote:
> I figured it would be all over the web if there were serious problems. I have no reason to doubt Tim's sincerity. Perhaps, someone involved with development could approach him to get more information about the supposed problems. I know if I had a problem, I'd be on this forum in a heartbeat.
>
> I'll be demoing Chirp at our next HAM meeting here in Seattle so need to do my due diligence about what I'm recommending!
>
> Charlie Stillman
> KC1S
> _______________________________________________
> chirp_users mailing list
> chirp_users at intrepid.danplanet.com
> http://intrepid.danplanet.com/mailman/listinfo/chirp_users

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Message: 4
Date: Thu, 17 Oct 2013 15:35:16 -0700 (PDT)
From: Milton Hywatt <mhywattt at yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [chirp_users] Tim at Yaesu Tech Support warns against
Chirp,	recommends RT Systems products
To: Discussion of CHIRP <chirp_users at intrepid.danplanet.com>
Message-ID:
<1382049316.15884.YahooMailNeo at web124506.mail.ne1.yahoo.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

Kickbacks from RTS sales to Yaesu? I've programmed my VX5, FT60, and FT8900 plenty of times 
with chirp, no problems. And like someone else suggested if there was a problem it will be all over
the internet. 




________________________________
From: Charles Stillman <datademon at aol.com>
To: chirp_users at intrepid.danplanet.com 
Sent: Thursday, October 17, 2013 6:02 PM
Subject: [chirp_users] Tim at Yaesu Tech Support warns against Chirp,	recommends RT Systems products


Tim at Yaesu tech support says that Chirp "burns out" EEPROMS on Yaesu radios. He says that results in the radios locking up. It was not clear whether he was saying that the EEPROM was destroyed or just programmed into a state that the radio would no longer work. I'm guessing that this might have been a problem during Chirp development and is no longer the case. I see that there are several steps involved in programming the Yaesu radios with Chirp. Does failure to follow the steps precisely create a risk to the usability of the radio? Sorry if this has been discussed before.

Tim assures me that he makes no money by recommending RT Systems stuff.

I sure appreciate the universality of Chirp.... support of multiple computing platforms (Mac in particular!), multiple radios! The value is huge since what holds back many beginners is the difficulty of programming in the channels!
_______________________________________________
chirp_users mailing list
chirp_users at intrepid.danplanet.com
http://intrepid.danplanet.com/mailman/listinfo/chirp_users
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Message: 5
Date: Thu, 17 Oct 2013 15:42:22 -0700
From: Dan Smith <dsmith at danplanet.com>
Subject: Re: [chirp_users] Tim at Yaesu Tech Support warns against
Chirp, recommends RT Systems products
To: Discussion of CHIRP <chirp_users at intrepid.danplanet.com>
Message-ID: <526067CE.5080507 at danplanet.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"

> Tim at Yaesu tech support says that Chirp "burns out" EEPROMS on 
> Yaesu radios.

Heh, interesting. As Tom says, CHIRP sends exactly the same content to
the radio as does a clone or programing operation from RTSystems. The
way almost all Yaesu radios are designed, you write the whole image
every time (can't get away with doing anything less, actually). So, the
exact same number of bytes are written to the radio, in the same order,
as using either other tool.

The radios themselves write to the eeprom every single time you turn the
VFO knob a single click in either direction. Think about how many writes
that turns into for a trip up and down the band looking for a contact.

IMHO, before CHIRP, keeping all my radios up to date was a lot harder
and a lot less fun. I definitely program my radios more now, but I'm
still a few orders of magnitude away from doing it often enough to be
wearing out the eeprom doing it :)

> I see that there are several steps involved in programming the Yaesu
> radios with Chirp. Does failure to follow the steps precisely create
> a risk to the usability of the radio?

No. If the radio was at risk for permanent failure due to a failure to
follow the instructions for programming that would be -- a pretty sorry
design for a radio :)

> Tim assures me that he makes no money by recommending RT Systems 
> stuff.

That seems kinda silly. Unlike the other manufacturers that actually
provide software for their radios, Yaesu relies on RTSystems to provide
a product that lets people program their radios. If RTSystems went out
of business tomorrow, Yaesu owners would have no commercial way to
program their radio(s) from their computer. So, call me crazy, but
there's definitely a dependent relationship there :)

> I sure appreciate the universality of Chirp....

Be sure to tell them! If Yaesu wanted to engage and tell me how sending
the same data over the same cable to the radio is "burning out eeproms"
I'd be happy to address it. Further, if users all let know Yaesu that
they would buy more radios if Yaesu would contribute hardware for
development work, we could certainly improve the level of support we
have for those radios.

Vote with your wallet! :)

-- 
Dan Smith
www.danplanet.com
KK7DS

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Message: 6
Date: Thu, 17 Oct 2013 18:49:28 -0400
From: Alex KG4TRV <kg4trv at hotmail.com>
Subject: [chirp_users] Maxtrac, Radius, GM300
To: "chirp_users at intrepid.danplanet.com"
<chirp_users at intrepid.danplanet.com>
Message-ID: <COL125-W15A0AD51B9E485386ABB9B87050 at phx.gbl>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"

There is one thing to get this motorolas to work properly has a repeater: reduce the power to 1/4 of a watt up to 5 watts and use it to drive an amplifier. then you have a 100% duty repeater. I can offer a loaner and something else.

Alex/KG4TRV
     
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Message: 7
Date: Thu, 17 Oct 2013 16:25:34 -0700
From: Charles Stillman <datademon at aol.com>
Subject: Re: [chirp_users] Tim at Yaesu Tech Support warns against
Chirp,	recommends RT Systems products
To: Discussion of CHIRP <chirp_users at intrepid.danplanet.com>
Message-ID: <D53BCFF2-86AE-4C84-97A8-8DE25C27C686 at aol.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1

Thanks for the reassurances!

And I did vote twice with my wallet {grin}. I not only bought 2 Icom handhelds a few years back, but I also sent a contribution to Chirp earlier today! Thanks for making our radio lives better!!

Charlie Stillman
KC1S


On Oct 17, 2013, at 3:42 PM, Dan Smith <dsmith at danplanet.com> wrote:

>> Tim at Yaesu tech support says that Chirp "burns out" EEPROMS on 
>> Yaesu radios.
> 
> Heh, interesting. As Tom says, CHIRP sends exactly the same content to
> the radio as does a clone or programing operation from RTSystems. The
> way almost all Yaesu radios are designed, you write the whole image
> every time (can't get away with doing anything less, actually). So, the
> exact same number of bytes are written to the radio, in the same order,
> as using either other tool.
> 
> The radios themselves write to the eeprom every single time you turn the
> VFO knob a single click in either direction. Think about how many writes
> that turns into for a trip up and down the band looking for a contact.
> 
> IMHO, before CHIRP, keeping all my radios up to date was a lot harder
> and a lot less fun. I definitely program my radios more now, but I'm
> still a few orders of magnitude away from doing it often enough to be
> wearing out the eeprom doing it :)
> 
>> I see that there are several steps involved in programming the Yaesu
>> radios with Chirp. Does failure to follow the steps precisely create
>> a risk to the usability of the radio?
> 
> No. If the radio was at risk for permanent failure due to a failure to
> follow the instructions for programming that would be -- a pretty sorry
> design for a radio :)
> 
>> Tim assures me that he makes no money by recommending RT Systems 
>> stuff.
> 
> That seems kinda silly. Unlike the other manufacturers that actually
> provide software for their radios, Yaesu relies on RTSystems to provide
> a product that lets people program their radios. If RTSystems went out
> of business tomorrow, Yaesu owners would have no commercial way to
> program their radio(s) from their computer. So, call me crazy, but
> there's definitely a dependent relationship there :)
> 
>> I sure appreciate the universality of Chirp....
> 
> Be sure to tell them! If Yaesu wanted to engage and tell me how sending
> the same data over the same cable to the radio is "burning out eeproms"
> I'd be happy to address it. Further, if users all let know Yaesu that
> they would buy more radios if Yaesu would contribute hardware for
> development work, we could certainly improve the level of support we
> have for those radios.
> 
> Vote with your wallet! :)
> 
> -- 
> Dan Smith
> www.danplanet.com
> KK7DS
> 
> _______________________________________________
> chirp_users mailing list
> chirp_users at intrepid.danplanet.com
> http://intrepid.danplanet.com/mailman/listinfo/chirp_users



------------------------------

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End of chirp_users Digest, Vol 58, Issue 30
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